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So what are you doing differently that you didn't do before?

Hi ChooseLove, I was just poking around here and I read your post #471. As I thought about it I wanted to say that whether a person is in the situation you find yourself or in one like mine- in which I have no one to ever hug me, no one to touch me, and I still have very strong physical intimacy needs, I think the solution is pretty much similar. I have found the most relief by just talking to God about how I feel and even crying alone in His Presence. He comforts me. Sometimes I am not even aware that He has been Present or comforted me but I notice that my neediness and irritability diminishes greatly. I am trusting Him more and more to meet every single need i have and he has not let me down yet!

This sounds good! Do You mean it? John 8:32 2 Corinthians 4:2 1 John 3:18

Ophelia there is a place of peace that you can experience in the midst of this storm. That is where the pray, plan, play advice comes in. A place of accepting that right now Riversedge seems to want to live in his own self-manufactured reality. I think that continually pointing out his abuse and lies when it is clear that he doesn't really want to change- right now- is only serving to hurt you further. Sometimes actions speak much louder than words. Can you think of some actions- responses that you can have ready to do or offer when he lies or triangulates. Like just turning and walking out of the room? Without saying a word. My ex was a master at gaining alliances for his victimization by me the angry "b---h." I know this game well. Can you speak to your son and explain to him what healthy relationships look like.. perhaps teach him to have a line for his dad that goes like this: "Dad, I don't want to hear anything about you and Mom if Mom isn't here." The reason this game works is because the people that are selected to be drawn into his little world usually have a need for love and validation themselves. They mistake the secrets and the attention as love or somehow it feeds their need to be a great counselor who is "impartial and fair." Whatever their unmet or unexpressed need is becomes the playing field for this evil. My ex seduced three different counselors that way! In a godly and Biblical husband-wife relationship you ARE to point things out but when he is making it clear that he is refusing your words, then your choice becomes action...your action... hence what this ministry teaches about divorcing, or going dark or ??? Because the truth is you can't change or control your husband and all the pointing out the truth in the world won't do anything. We are to continually offer truth because who knows at what point the light may come on and grace may kick in? Since I haven't followed your thread all the way and it seems as if you have been to one intensive that changes the landscape a bit. Whatever Joel and Kathy are advising, follow that.

Ophelia it's good to document whatever you have documented because it does several things... When we go back and read we can see more clearly what is really happening. We can see the growth we have made and we can remember the things that we wives have learned so well to minimize and sweep under the carpet! It sounds like all the hard feelings you are having may be related to really seeing clearly just how abusive your life has been. Don't be afraid of these feelings or try not to have them. They are a sign that you are beginning to realize what is really important in life and what is true and right! Just don't let them control you and sweep you away into bitterness or vengeful attitudes or actions. I am glad you are leaning on the Lord. I have just been through some of what you have been through in the last four years. I HATED that my daughter had to go to dad's house! She was sixteen when visitation started and it was HORRIBLE. He became so perverse and immoral and has broken every single court order. In the middle of it I was so upset and so angry! But God patiently and carefully led me through that season and my daughter is stronger, wiser and more knowledgeable about what makes a good man today! While I would never recommend having to let my children be around a bad father... God used it for good. Her heart was crushed when she realized that she really wasn't Daddy's girl and that he really only cared for himself... but some very wise people in our church have held her up in prayer and God used them to take up the pain and help her face truth! The bottom line is this: Whatever you choose, know that God does have you in the palm of His Hand and His redemption and grace are powerful beyond what we can think or imagine. No matter how bad one decision or the other seems, do your best to follow truth and righteousness and God will see to the rest! Part of truth and righteousness is allowing our husbands to experience the results of their choices. That's what this ministry is about!

Hi MJ, Sorry I didn't see this.. Yes the teaching is a four part series and each is about an hour I think. It was so interesting to me that I played and prayed it all in the first week. Here is something I just got from my friend Christine and well worth looking at: https://beyondbetrayal.community/about/ And here is a great video page of testimonies. The one at the bottom is very much like many of the women in our forum: https://beyondbetrayal.community/videos/

Very insightful words, Ophelia!! This sums up the whole problem in a nutshell and it's about identity. When our identity is in Christ we are able to put aside these other substitutions! Expressing the problem this way shows you how to pray as well. Until Christ be formed in us!

ChooseLove, I hope you listen to this. I loved it so much that I listened to all four hours and have just had such an amazing shift in my understanding of God. And relationships. And everything else I already knew.

And also, I like that you are getting braver! I like that you are seeing that you need those touches and that Zed is seeing it too! This looks like some progress to me!

HA! I just now saw this, MJ.. What a great idea!! Yes, this "word" should be delivered! If you haven't already...

Here is some GOOD preaching! This is the understanding I have been looking for. i have had to stop and restart this multiple times because it says so much... but in a nutshell it explains why marriages go south! Worth all the time you might give this...

This is all good! For some reason I feel led to post this old Rodgers and Hammerstein song for you. Don't really know why but sit down with the Lord and let Him minister to you as you listen, OK?

HI MJ, I don't think you actually have to help Zed cultivate more sensitivity.. just don't do all the work for him.. and up to now it has been important that you do it just the way you have been because you have been asserting yourself, loving yourself and finding yourself instead of getting lost in intimidation. So... I think that if you just have a little talk with him and tell him that you would like him to think about things sometimes instead of you just cooking, serving and cleaning up.. you'd like him to do some of the cooking and serving.... does this analogy fit for you?? Zed sounds a little bored and apathetic because there aren't any new challenges.. I would be praying for LIGHT and hope into his soul and ask God if there is anything zany or fun you could do!!