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We either need THAT or a MIRACLE!!! This man is driving me insane! Oh, I already said that, huh? Oh, sorry! :wink:

 

I THINK that we are making progress, but WOW, he sure complicates things!!

 

I sent him what I posted and asked, "did i do an okay job of stating what we discussed??" He sais, "Yes, you did great." (Just so you know that we are both in agreement, and this is not a "he said, she said" issue.)

 

Then he said, "Yeah, it hurts my head to read about it now - I can't believe that I am trying to live like this! No wonder you feel insane."

 

Ummm... yeah. :? Has anyone seen my Calgon???

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Sorry to keep posting on both thread, but I had to add this...

 

(Copied from my thread)

I THINK that we are making progress, but WOW, he sure complicates things!!

 

I sent him what I posted and asked, "did i do an okay job of stating what we discussed??" He sais, "Yes, you did great." (Just so you know that we are both in agreement, and this is not a "he said, she said" issue.)

 

Then he said, "Yeah, it hurts my head to read about it now - I can't believe that I am trying to live like this! No wonder you feel insane."

 

Ummm... yeah. Confused Has anyone seen my Calgon???

 

HD is home now, and he seems thoroughly perplexed by this afternoon. I pray that he FINALLY sees that his own thought process does not make any sense, and is going to kill us! :?

 

He is taking some "down time" with our son to play a video game. We discovered that his temperament needs some time after work to "decompress" and since we live about 2 miles from work, he does not have a commute to do that for him. This might be a good answer for us!

 

He still is not talking to me about his mood. Oh well. The problem is that if I can feel his tension, I will never feel safe with him. Not sure how to get him to open up. That is an exhausting endeavor. I have been trying for 20 years.

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Eeyore,you downloaded that HerDensity said:

 

1) He has convinced himself that he is supposed to initiate conversation with me... even if I just told him to leave me alone, or I asked him to do something else, or whatever. So, if I want space, he feels like if he listens to me, then he is RESPONDING, and it only counts as INITIATING if he asks me a question, which I respond to!

 

The problem with this thinking is that he will NEVER act to bless me, because he feels like he is RESPONDING.

 

ToddlerNoMore was similarly confused about this initiating vs responding issue. Have HD find it on TNM's string. Helpers gave clarifications and TNM voiced his own viewpoint tweak which enable him to understand the difference.

 

The more that HD drinks in teachings here on the forum, even ones that go way back, in the books, and from you, the more he will get this.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Abigail

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Anxiety...

 

Steve is in the other room working on his letter to my family. I am so afraid that he will over think it, and it will come out too forced. But more than that, I am afraid that he does not see or feel how betrayed I feel by my family, and how much he has hurt me.

 

I know that it is probably too early for him to "feel my pain". But in this instance, I need for that to happen. I need for him to speak truth into this situation, even if it is difficult for him.

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It is 3:30am and I can't sleep. I am sorry for being so needy. You are probably sick of seeing me post, but I need to get this out.

 

Okay, we went to an Intensive. And I know that I cannot expect HD to change overnight. But when is it going to start?

 

Last night, as I mentioned, he came home and was stressed about work. He played some Xbox with our son, and that was all good. Then he dropped our daughter off at youth group and came home (we decided not to go to church last night, we were both too spent and wanted to just hang out). He started watching a movie with me and our son, and began working on his letter to my parents. He felt distracted and left the room to sit at the kitchen table to work on the letter. Then he went to get our daughter, came home, and played some more video game with our son.

 

So far, so good, right? We were just hanging out, he was not doting on me, he took me for a lunch date yesterday, he took our daughter to youth group and let me stay home. All good stuff, right??

 

Well, as the evening wore on, I had this feeling of unease. I was extremely discouraged. I could not shake it, so I went to bed. Now it is 3:30am, and I woke up and it hit me.

 

When HD came home, he was obviously stressed. I was not sure if it was due to work or all that we had discussed at lunch, but he seemed overwhelmed. I asked him if everything was okay, and after the usual lie, he said that he was stressed about a big work meeting the next day. Our son asked him to play some video game, and realizing that he needed this "decompress" time, suggested that he do that. Afterward he thanked me and told me that he felt the stress come off him by playing the game. Still all good stuff, right?

 

Well, this is what hit me...

 

It was still all about him. He still does not realize that if he comes home stressed, I still need a smile. He needs to lay his mood down and love me.

 

I helped him understand things at lunch, made a nice dinner, suggested that he play with our son... and I feel like not only am I the one doing the blessing, but it is all returning void. Well, he feels better, but this is not supposed to be about him.

 

I told him yesterday that I feel like he is flirting with the program and won't take it seriously until I kick him out. But I was reading August's story in the men's sections and came across this...

 

Joel wrote a long time ago, that there's a big difference between a man who is sorry for what he has lost and one who is sorry for what he has done to his wife and family.

 

And this...

 

if you are in this simply to WIN HER BACK, you are in it for the WRONG reasons, and it will not work out.

 

I want to shock this man into opening his eyes. But I realize now that if I end up going down that road, and he becomes all nice, that it will be for the wrong reasons. I just realized (as I was typing this) that I had told him that very thing before the Intensive. The only time that he acts nice is when he is "in trouble" and he is trying to win me back... and that can't be trusted because it does not show a change of heart. So, I am nowhere.

 

Seriously, I am a patient woman. I am a smart woman. God has given me an unbelievable amount of grace for this man. I can see his potential even when he is at his worst.

 

I know that he is working on the letter to my family, and that is a step in the right direction. I have great fears about what it will say (or not say) but that is not in my hands.

 

But I am not seeing any FRUIT here. It is still all about him. And I don't know what to do. I cannot hold his hand every minute and explain that it hurts when he ignores me, or it hurts when I (once again) explain my needs and nothing changes, or it hurts when he is distracted because of work, etc, etc, etc.

 

I know that I am supposed to be a helpmeet. But I honestly don't feel that he has taken the first step.

 

Here are some things that he HAS done... (or he is making progress in)

* stop waiting on me

* stop kissing me constantly (although there are times when he goes to kiss me, I go to respond, and he will pull away because he is not "supposed to" kiss me so much)

* take me on a dinner and a lunch date

* brought me gifts on Fridays

* gotten on the calls every Thursday, and a couple other nights when I have asked to

* posted on the forum and asked for help

 

And I do not want to seem unappreciative... but most of the things that he has made progress in this week are about him stopping doing something that drive me crazy (like waiting on me). Most of the other things he was doing before the Intensive. Some of them (like asking for help and not filtering everything that he posts through his emotional filters) has just begun.

 

But I can tell that he is not putting me first. It is still about him being stressed, or about him not understanding the process (so I have to explain it to him), or about him over-thinking things (so I have to explain it to him), or about him trying too hard (so I have to explain it to him).

 

I am trying REALLY hard to step out of the "counselor" role. But I think that I see what the problem is...

 

We go on a date (like lunch yesterday). I start talking about how he can bless me (trying to be a helpmeet), I explain some things to him (like letting me talk when I need to talk and not forcing things), it gets in depth, and when we are done, I think, "Okay, that was progress... he finally understands". Then, the next day, I realize that I ministered to him, I met his needs, I offered support to him, and I feel like I was the counselor, because nothing changes...

 

When he came home yesterday, unless him car was on fire, he should have smiled at me. He should have taken me in his arms for a "heart" hug. He should have looked me in the eye and asked how my day was. We DISCUSSED THIS FOUR HOURS BEFORE!! I explained this all to him! But he came home stressed and distracted, and did NOT lay down his emotions to bless me. When does he think that he is going to FEEL LIKE doing this? How can I get him to understand that he HAS TO do this, no matter what, THEN the FEELINGS will follow. We just discussed this!! UGH!!

 

Please help me. I am at my whit's end. I am so discouraged. How can I ever feel safe and begin to heal when I am pouring all of my energy into him? I am desperate. I want my marriage to end so I can get some relief and just REST.

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Hi Eeyore,

 

I know how you feel about explaining it all to him then getting NOTHING, NO RESULTS.

No one is tired of seeing you post. Don't worry about that. :) :)

I want to thank you for posting this, you helped me with it.

I couldn't put into words what you have said.

I know I am not at a good point to offer you any advice.

But I offer you acceptance and encouragement.

I will pray for you,

B

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Thanks, Bimmer. I am so blessed to know that by sharing my struggles, it is helping someone else. Maybe this is not all in vain! :wink:

 

This morning HD woke me up and apologized. But I don't think that he is getting it yet. He told me that it is sinking in. I am not sure.

 

He said that after he played the video game (and HE felt better), he should have turned his attention to me. Ummm... no. He should have turned his attention to me immediately, despite how he was feeling when he walked in the door. THAT is dying to yourself.

 

The other day we had this long conversation about what "fake it til you make it" means that you DO what has been laid out for you, even when the feelings are not there. UGH!

 

He said that he is behind on a report that he needs to do for work. I am okay with him working from home when he needs to, but I am NOT okay with his selfish, stressful attitude. But he thinks that he did good that chose not to work, even when the stress was so thick, I could have cut it with a knife. Ummm... no.

 

I was up from 3-6am... just a LITTLE tired now. Ugh! Oh well, Looney is stopping over in a while! Yay! At least my day will have some spark of sunshine!

 

8)

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I told him this morning that he needs to stop asking, "Why am I not doing the right thing?".

 

I told him..."That is what sends us down the "counselor" trail, and that trail is a dead end."

 

"You don't do it because you are a selfish toddler. That is why we went to the Intensive, so you could understand that. The end..."

 

 

Can I make it any clearer to him? I have nothing else to say.

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Eeyore

 

Sounds like he hasn't come to the conclusion that your marriage is in crisis mode..which is what he should be thinking and feeling at this point...I swear you post sound just like mine in the beginning...it really is spooky for me to read your words and know that I have written the same things and felt the same things...

 

Also...he does sound as if he is confused as to what he needs to be doing....You're stronger than I was at this point, in telling your husband what it is that you need... You spelled it out right here...

 

In the beginning we wives have to look at our husbands like they are a 5 year old....and teach them...this is being a help-meet..

 

But at some point we have to let go and let them grab onto the message too...

 

One other thing that I noticed was that maybe he's not picking up on your clues...Something he's going to have to work hard at doing....

 

For example: You said that he was trying to initiate a conversation while you just wanted to watch TV and have some popcorn..Nothing wrong with that...You gave him the clue there...by sitting down with a bowl of popcorn and the TV on.....that was not the time to try to initiate conversation....

 

What he could have done was: Quitely get up, make sure you had something to drink (without asking you of course), and sit beside you and watched the show together...then afterwards he could have asked is there anything on your heart that you wanted to talk about... If nothing was there...he should leave it alone...cuddle and loved on you (if you are able to do that...would have been a good time to just rub your back)

 

As for coming home stressed out... Yes I agree he needs to leave that at the door before walking in...

 

Question? How long is his commute from work to home?

 

He should be using that time maybe listening to worship music in the car...focusing on what he's going to doing to do when he gets home to be a blessing...He should never bring home the stress from work...that needs to stay at work... So he walks in the door...with a smile on his face, a kiss on the cheek (or mouth depending on what you are comfortable with) and a hug...with a big "I've missed you so much today" attitude...

 

Sometimes these guys do have to "fake it to make it"...especially in the beginning...because they are learning a new way of living...but the good news is...the more they put it into practice...it becomes second nature for them...and yes, we wives do feel it when its fake...but this is where we have to respond...with a thanks...hard I know...but we still have to respond to them trying....They can't learn any other way...

 

I know that you want all the changes to come from his heart and be over night...I wish that I could wave a magic wand to make that happen...but it wont...The good news is..the longer he does these things...the more natural they will start to feel....

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Hi Hope,

Thanks for your response.

 

A couple responses to what you said... his commute is only 2 miles. That is a problem and I know that his temperament needs to "decompress" when he gets home. So, that is why I recommended the video game. But he should have smiled at me when he came in. Period. Even if he did not feel like it. Right? (We are going to look at houses further from work, but with our future uncertain, I am not sure if that is a good idea right now.)

 

And he said that he should have turned his attention to me after he played the video game and felt better. True... but that did not happen either. (And I still should have gotten a smile when he walked in, even if he did not feel like it!)

 

You said...

 

Sometimes these guys do have to "fake it to make it"...especially in the beginning...because they are learning a new way of living...but the good news is...the more they put it into practice...it becomes second nature for them...

 

Yes, I agree. And I know that it might feel like he is faking it. I am okay with that. The problem is that he is not PUTTING IT INTO PRACTICE. It is like he is waiting for his Fairy Godmother to come along and sprinkle some magic dust on him and make him want to do this. He will suddenly have a perfect understanding of the how and why of the process, and THEN he will begin the process. NO! NO! NO!

 

You are right, he does NOT understand that the marriage is in crisis. His every thought revolves around himself.

 

I am sorry if I am grumpy in my responses. I am not sure how much longer I can do this...

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You did right in encouraging him to decompress a little with the games....but that should only last about 15/30 minutes at the most...afterwards he MUST turn his attention to blessing you..being focused on you totally....

 

I understand that you are frustrated...but he is putting it into practice..He's just not getting it right most of the time...He is trying...Just not in the ways you need him to be doing so....so we have to give him a little credit here...he wants to do this and is really trying....This is going to take time here. He does understand (for the most part) in what he's supposed to do..its in the execution of how to do it that's frustrating..for both of you I am sure.. This is where you have to be strong...and know what it is that you really need from him and communicate to him clearly what you are needing.. Which you did in your post...

 

I know that Jeff would totally over think things ...and ended up confusing himself too...which made me feel like giving up and kicking him out....So what I had to do was think like a teacher would with a room full of preschoolers.. (I was a teacher was many years..LOL)

 

First. I made a list and put it in a place that I was sure he would see it everyday.. On this list was "ways" that he could bless me..

Take out the garbage

Straighten up the living room

Do home work with the kids

Cook dinner, etc......

 

There was probably about 20 things on that list...Now I asked him to look at the list each and everyday..and pick at least 3 things on it that he could do WITHOUT asking me what I needed....I never expected him to do all of the things of this list.. that would be impossible...but to do at least 3 of these things that would really help..

 

Now I didn't always notice when he would do these things..so sometimes I didn't respond to them.Which he had to learn to "not get his feelings" hurt overt..But to still do these things with a smile on his face even if he got no response...

 

But when I would notice him doing these things.. I would respond pretty quickly with nothing more than a "thank you." (for Jeff I told him that he's to think of the words "thank you" as the most precious gift he's ever received from me.)

 

Then there were times when I needed him to do something on the list that he didn't do.. That's when I would have to speak up and say to him directly... Thank you for taking out the garbage...while I am cooking dinner could you please do homework with the kids." (and no this didn't always come out nicely either..most of the time it was sarcastic) etc....

 

After doing this for a while...he should increase the amount of things he would do on the list..going from 3 things to maybe 5 things on the list...Again.. all without asking me "what I needed"..

 

Now...he doesn't ask me what I might need to be a blessing to me...Now he looks around for anything he can do to be a blessing...and we don't have that list out anymore..because now its become second nature for him to do these things that bless me.

 

I know that this might sound pretty simplistic here...but it does work...

 

Did you ever get a chance to work on that marriage manual?

 

That would really help him as well..to have something in black and white that he can read over everyday...and learn about what you need from him...

 

I'm not trying to beat up on you... I think you are doing a wonderful job in this..and I totally understand what you are going through here...we just need to take things one step at a time here...we can't do everything all at once....

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Well, things are going poorly again today, all due to me. I am not putting the basics into practice - the 20/20/20 is really all that I should be focusing on right now, but I have myself convinced that there is so much more that I should be doing, that I am just shutting down.

 

Today, my wife posted this:

I want my marriage to end so I can get some relief and just REST.

 

Obviously, I have her on the ropes again. I will focus on her and doing the basics today, and just making her first.

 

I am going to put something on here that I need help with, and I know that she's not the right one to talk to about this (even though she'll read it) - I know that this is selfish and bordering on abusiveness (if there's a difference), but it's eating me up inside and starting to make more sense to me than the program I am supposed to be trying to focus on. Please straighten me out:

 

I believe that I am more convinced that my wife and family would be happier sooner without me - she could take the insurance money, set aside chunks for college (we have NO funds for that - I am a horrible financial planner), pay off our house in Cinci (which would give her rental income), and pour her life into the kids instead of me for the remainder of their at-home lives. After paying off those things, she could still have some money left to live off, or maybe go to school and finish her Interior Design degree. I feel like a roadblock, and even if I am a better husband, I will not be able to provide these things for her. Live with me will be a long road, full of potholes and speed bumps, and she is too good of a person to have to deal with that.

 

I know that this just shows that I think that the only thing I bring to the marriage is money and security - I think that might be how she feels, too. She isn't getting anything else from it, that's for sure.

 

I know that I am feeling sorry for myself here, and I don't care how hard I need to get smacked out of this. I am not trying to put this on Eeyore - she hasn't done ANYTHING to make me feel this way - this just is making WAY to much sense to me right now.

 

Hopefully, writing this down will help it go away.

HD

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HD

 

In writing this..you are basically telling your wife that she is NOT worth doing this for....You have now allowed the enemy to come back in and tell you that you "can't do this...and now you are believing that once again...

 

You need to hit your knees right now and pray for the Lord to give you the strength you need to die to self and heal your wife's heart...You have to start believing that you can do this...

 

Right now..after reading your post..It sounds like you don't believe that you can do it...now your wife is going to be in an even darker place than she has been in the past couple of days...

 

Jeff did this a couple of times to me as well.. and I can tell you...its a very dark, scary place to be in for your wife...

 

You have now taken the focus off your wife and put that focus back on yourself again...

 

You can do this..and you have been doing it...just not in the ways that are healing for your wife...This is where you really must listen!!!!!!!!!!

 

I've been talking to your wife all morning on her string...and she's sinking here....so what are you going to do about it? Let her drown or throw her a life vest and save her?

 

I've given her some ways to help you...but that's about all she can do..is tell you...its up to you to put it into action and do the things she's asking...

 

You need to really listen and pick up on her clues here...She said that you are not doing the 20/20/20 each and everyday..WHY NOT??? That should be the easiest thing to do in this whole program....

 

Why are you not...because you JUST DON'T WANT TO!

 

You should be feeling like you are in a crisis here and as a man should want to do what ever it takes to put out the fire ...But instead you are sitting there feeling sorry for yourself...SNAP OUT OF IT! (yes I am yelling at you there)

 

There is NO excuse for this...when you start to feel these "I can't" thoughts...you need to take them to the Lord here...you have to die to these thoughts..because that is nothing more than self-defeating here...

 

Do you want your wife and kids to have a life without you? Do you want to see another man be father to your children? Husband to your wife? I don't think so... but staying in these thoughts..that's what you are pushing her towards...That's not being a man...that's being a child....GROW UP!

 

As for other things that are going on.. .I think you are confused a little here as well as in how and what to do.. how to execute this program in your lives...

 

For example: Yesterday...you should have walked in the door with a SMILE on your face, gave your wife a kiss and hug with the attitude that "You've missed her so much today." (blessing one)

 

Then she gave you time to decompress with playing games with your kids.. (SHE WAS BLESSING YOU HERE..you should have thanked her again with another smile, hug and kiss.)

 

Then take the time to LOOK AROUND you and see where you can be a blessing to her..WITHOUT asking her like a kid would ask a mommy to tell him what to do..Did the trash need taking out? Did the kids homework need doing? What ever is happening in your home life and works...(blessing number two)

 

Later on that evening...you SAW her sitting there wanting to watch a show and have some popcorn...but instead YOU wanted to initiate conversation.. (which would be fine..had you NOT picked up on her clue here)..instead...sit beside her and watch the show together...fix her a drink if she needed one..hold her hand here...(blessing number three)

 

Afterwards: Once the show was over..Bless her again...you could have sat there and cuddled with her, loving on her, rub her back.etc....(blessing number four)

 

You really have to WATCH for where you can be a blessing...and REALLY listen to her when she is talking to you.. After the show was over would have been the perfect time to ask her if there was anything she wanted to talk about.. If not.. again...you could have sat there just loving on her....

 

You can't do this in your own flesh...on your own strength here...you really need to make sure you are calling on the Lord for your strength...

 

So once again...you have put yourself into this situation and once again have hurt your wife...all because you took your focus off your wife and put it back on yourself...

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I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. I am not seeing that he is putting this into practice.

 

He is thinking about it, and talking about it. That is it.

 

I did list the "good" things that he is doing...

Here are some things that he HAS done... (or he is making progress in)

* stop waiting on me

* stop kissing me constantly (although there are times when he goes to kiss me, I go to respond, and he will pull away because he is not "supposed to" kiss me so much)

* take me on a dinner and a lunch date

* brought me gifts on Fridays

* gotten on the calls every Thursday, and a couple other nights when I have asked to

* posted on the forum and asked for help

 

But I won't give him credit where credit is not due. It is that simple. His thoughts and actions revolve around himself. Period.

 

If he is in a bad mood, I get bad mood. If he is stressed, I get stress. He is trying to force me to talk, because he thinks that he is "doing something". So I will give him that. But he is not getting it. Period.

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I don't want to say this to him, as it would sound like I am just concerned about the money. But most insurance policies do not cover for suicide. If that is what he is thinking, someone should point that out to him...

 

Another blow from a selfish man. All about him... waaahh!!!

 

I need him to find some place to stay. I don't want him to come home tonight. I may be wrong in this, but I really don't care anymore.

 

Hope, you laid it out perfectly in your post to him... very basic terms which he should be able to understand... very basic steps to bless me. And you are right, he does not want to do it. And I am okay with that... I understand what J&K teach. I understand the arrested development and the mother-son issues. I understand the impact of the abuse and the impact of the years of porn. As I said, I am a smart woman... not to brag, but I get it.

 

What I do have a problem with is the fact that he will not choose to do the right thing... because he can't understand that he needs to just do it. It is making me crazy.

 

So, back to his post... he would either... a) leave me destitute, with 2 houses to pay for and a bleak future for my kids, or B) force me to divorce him and say good bye to all of those dreams which he thinks he would solve by this final act of selfishness and abuse.

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gaininghope - I agree with everything that you've said, completely. I wasn't threatening as much as I was laying out what was going on in my head, just to get it out. Usually, that's something that I do to Eeyore, and I knew that wasn't right, so I put it here.

 

My goal today was still to bless her, but I needed to let those thoughts out, as they were just consuming too many thought cycles. I know myself well enough to know that if I don't dump that out somehow, someway (this was where SG/porn always came into the picture), then I would never stop the thoughts long enough to think about her.

 

If I need to go somewhere else for a while, I will - I guess I am confused about being able to vent somewhere, and not get kicked out as a result. This isn't supposed to be the kind of crap that I dump on her when I am in this place, and I can't let it run rampant in my brain - so, I thought I picked the better option.

 

I KNOW that my wife is worth living for, and that my family is - it would KILL me to know that someone else was raising my kids and kissing my wife. I also know that I am just feeling sorry for myself - this was my attempt to SNAP OUT OF IT, and get my head out...

 

There isn't a way to post honestly without hurting my wife more.

 

HD

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HD,

 

What you focus on is what gets fed.

If you are focusing on your failures, your pain, you insecrities, you stress, your worries, your feelings...

Every one of those little monsters is getting fed. And fed well, according to what I see in your post.

 

YOU have to make the choice to starve those guys.

How?

 

Quit feeding them.

 

The best way is to feed and water the good things

When you feel self-pity, tell Eeyore....

"Hon, I feel like I am slipping into self-pity here...give me something to do for you so I can focus on that!"

When you feel yourself internalizing and focusing on how you feel, tell Eeyore...

"Sweetheart, I feel like I am on the slipperly slope of focusing too much on my feelings, can we talk about yours? I want to focus on you."

 

Each and every time you begin to self-focus...STOP.

Think about Eeyore and blessing her.

IF you aren't sure how, ASK HER.

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Eeyore,

I read HD's post and yeah, completely inappropriate and self-focused.

 

You said:

 

When he came home yesterday, unless him car was on fire, he should have smiled at me. He should have taken me in his arms for a "heart" hug. He should have looked me in the eye and asked how my day was. We DISCUSSED THIS FOUR HOURS BEFORE!! I explained this all to him! But he came home stressed and distracted, and did NOT lay down his emotions to bless me. When does he think that he is going to FEEL LIKE doing this? How can I get him to understand that he HAS TO do this, no matter what, THEN the FEELINGS will follow. We just discussed this!! UGH!!

 

You have to understand, Eeyore, that in HD's case (and most toddler men) you HAVE to explain it over and over and over.....I know you think he should get it when you just talked about it 4 hours ago, but think about a regular toddler...

How many times do you have to tell them to stay away from the electrical outlet?

TONS.

 

I KNOW this is SOOO frustrating for you. One very difficult thing for women doing this is to step into "mommy" mode....telling our husbands, over and over, things that we THINK should be so easy! Are you kidding me, didn't we JUST discuss this!

 

SO, when he comes home and is self-focusing...tell him.

"HD, I feel unease because I can TELL something is going on. I need you to knock it off long enough to give me a heartfelt hug. Don't focus so much on you that you ignore me!"

Then keep telling him.

 

He will get it, Eeyore. Not nearly as fast as you would like, but he will.

But you have to keep telling him.

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quiverof4 - thanks. You are right, and my focus is something that has been talked about a lot lately. Unfortunately, it was on me again yesterday evening, and was again this morning - my attempt to dump that self-focus here on the forum didn't go over well with Eeyore.

 

The biggest problem in our marriage is that I have never been honest about my feelings. I have live in a strange world where I acted like I didn't think that my emotions were worth talking about, and then spend every waking hour being ruled by them. I know that I need to get out of that mode of thinking, but that Eeyore is not the path for that - she has been my counselor for our entire marriage, and it is the most exhausting job in the world. She doesn't have the strength or patience for it any more, so she has been relieved of that duty - and it's the forum's turn. That's why I turned there this morning, and dumped my honest feelings without processing for probably one of the first times in my life.

 

My goal in dumping the feelings was to turn my focus away from myself by tossing it out in writing and moving on. I didn't want it to hurt Eeyore, and that wasn't my goal. I should be mature enough to turn it over to God without bitching about it here, but I am not that mature.

 

HD

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NO you don't have to go anywhere else.. You say that you needed to vent the thoughts in your head... that's fine...but the thoughts in your head is what is destroying you...Anytime you allow any negative thought to come in..you are allowing Satan to control you....You have to give those kinds of thoughts to the Lord here...

 

No one is going to "kick you out"..we only want to help you and show you a better way...and that way is to take those kinds of thoughts to the Lord...take them captive..

 

Each time you allow yourself to think such destructive thoughts..you take that focus off your wive and put it back on yourself....

 

Even to "think" about what you were thinking about is abusive...You need to see that...

 

What you should be praying right now is for the Lord to come in and show you how to be a blessing to your wife...

 

Its' fine to vent when you are messing up....its in the vent that allows us to help you through it...and show you how you can change it around...But when you come here with thoughts of killing yourself...that's different...I'm glad to hear that you were only "feeling" this way and were not planning on acting on it...that would be the ultimate abuse...

 

So lets get back on track here....

 

It seems that you might be feeling unsure of what you are supposed to be doing...Right now your wife is feeling that all you are doing is thinking to much about these things....(we talked today on the phone by the way)

 

You and Jeff are so much alike...I feel like I am going to have to hit you over the head too like I did with Jeff...

 

I wonder if you have been hearing the message about getting your wife to open up and "vent" and share her feelings..that maybe you are taking it a little to far... Yes, we do ask men to do this..but in your case..its not all that needed...since you have a wife who is very vocal in this area...what you need to be doing..instead of "analyzing" or try to "fix"things is just to LISTEN, VALIDATE HER, LOVE HER...

 

Listen: means to just listen..not say anything, don't go into your mind an form an answer right away... just be in the moment and listen to her...

 

Validate: Tell her you understand what she is saying, express some empathy for her or the feelings she's feeling. Say "your" sorry for that experience..

 

While doing this...you need to be WITH HER.. touching her. Hold her hand, touch her shoulder, put your hand on her leg...just make sure you are touching her....that allows you to stay in the moment with her... Hug her, afterwards...cry with her if you are able to feel what she is feeling...

 

In the area of Blessing her: Blessing her does not mean SERVING her... She doesn't need you to do things for her..She needs you to bless her...( I misunderstood what she was saying about this until we talked) Special time together one night a week..(date night), gifts (are you doing this?) Smiles? Hugs? Kisses?

 

Checking your mood before you walk in the house after work...Make sure you are leaving your stress, bad moods etc behind you at work and not bring them into the house and around her...When you are feeling these things...you can bet she will be responding to them.. So if you are in a bad mood...so will she..then the cycle starts all over again...Remember you INITATE good towards your wife...and she will RESPOND good towards you...You initiate stress and then she will respond with stress...

 

Steve.. you can do this...you need to believe in yourself that you can do this...you need to really believe in this ministry...and in the Lord...You can't do this in your own strength here....and you can't do this in your own mind...you have to call on the Lord for that strength...

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HD,

A word of clarity and caution.

 

I do believe you are right that dumping all these feelings on Eeyore, having her be hour counselor, having her bear the brunt of the burden of "getting you to open up" etc...

That is wrong, for sure. This is too much of a burden for her.

 

BUT, that is different than flat-out asking Eeyore, WHAT SHE NEEDS right now.

You need to ask her what to DO, and ask her regularly.

 

Don't ask her things like "Why can't I get this?" "Why is this so hard for me?" "How can I stop doing A, B, or C?" "Why do I keep feeling this way?"

 

Ask her "What can I do for you RIGHT NOW, EEYORE?"

"What do you need me to do RIGHT NOW, EEYORE?"

THEN listen to her heart, don't overanalyze and DO IT.

EEYORE is your manual to maturity.

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Well, as the evening wore on, I had this feeling of unease. I was extremely discouraged. I could not shake it, so I went to bed. Now it is 3:30am, and I woke up and it hit me.

 

When HD came home, he was obviously stressed. I was not sure if it was due to work or all that we had discussed at lunch, but he seemed overwhelmed. I asked him if everything was okay, and after the usual lie, he said that he was stressed about a big work meeting the next day. Our son asked him to play some video game, and realizing that he needed this "decompress" time, suggested that he do that. Afterward he thanked me and told me that he felt the stress come off him by playing the game. Still all good stuff, right?

 

Well, this is what hit me...

 

It was still all about him. He still does not realize that if he comes home stressed, I still need a smile. He needs to lay his mood down and love me.

 

This is pretty simple.

 

You simply say,

 

"Hey honey, I realized, at 3:30 am - that even though yesterday was a good day - and I don't have any complaints about anything on the surface, that after work, when you came home stressed, you did not come home, searching me out to initiate a smile, hug and positive interaction like Joel and Kathy teach. Instead, you were stressed and you came through the door, letting that be known."

 

Why don't you want him to kiss you? Kissing is not a natural part of his base temperament - and your base temperament is to want a lot of touching, kisses etcetera.

 

Don't shut down a positive part of your temperament and don't shut down him acting outside of his natural temperament. If you feel like he is kissing you instead of other things, then ask him to do the other things - but don't shut down the kisses. You are going to make him feel like he is in a world of schizophrenia - "Okay, guys - your job is to initiate 20 hugs, smiles and kisses" and then a wife says, "no, don't do that!"

 

Summary:

 

1. You are not being overly picky about his homecoming. He needed to focus on you.

 

2. Because of your stress level and wounding, it was not a simple "Hey honey, I just realized.. and sandwiching what you realized with the good that he actually did that day. You ended up getting all stressed over something that when you are healthy, will just be a very simple thing to point out.

 

3. You don't want to shut down the healing processes in him or yourself by shutting down the hugs, smiles and/or kisses. Work the program the way we teach it. That is a very important aspect - no less important than a weekly date, hubby opening car door for you, regular lovemaking etcetera.

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