Free Dog and Chrystal - working towards an OHM

[truth]

The best advise steve and I have is to do the opposite of what you feel in the m/s moment. Remember, she is my wife, my lover and I need her. Press in with her. Lots of oxytocin, hugs, smiles, kisses and compliments. Fight every ounce of resistance in yourself. By doing this it helps you grow up and out of m/s.

[Crystal]

The best advise steve and I have is to do the opposite of what you feel in the m/s moment. Remember, she is my wife, my lover and I need her. Press in with her. Lots of oxytocin, hugs, smiles, kisses and compliments. Fight every ounce of resistance in yourself. By doing this it helps you grow up and out of m/s.

Thanks, truth! I texted your answer to FreeDog. He didn't like my initial response to his post. I thought it was classic "passive, look at me I'm a such a good guy. Tryin' so hard!"

We had five really nice days and then he crashed in self-pity and self-love yesterday. I am probably not supposed to be on his thread making sarcastic remarks, but I'm happy to see your patient answer here. Thanks.

Edited September 17, 2011 by Crystal

[JoelandKathy]

Trusting you are back on a good roll now?

 

Kathy tells me about the text updates from you Chrystal.. but hey Freedog.. would love to read your update here..

[KathyandJoel]

A quote I put up on Crystal's string.

 

Aiming to make it through DAY 6. Go Free Dog, Go Free Dog! You can do it! You can do it! ::clap

 

He is aiming for the "GOLD METAL."

 

And there is his lovely wife, Crystal, cheering him along, all the way to the "FINISH LINE." Wooooo Hooooo! ::clap

 

Blessings,

 

20% is great, but 100% is better. Ok, it is great to think that THIS time he will make it all the way, and I believe he Can!

 

Will you Freedog? Will you make that sacrifice to lay your life down for your BRIDE! To hold her dear to you heart and value and love her in action, word and deed?

 

The answer is_______________?????

 

(rewsna: (the word "answer" backwards)

 

yes!

[JoelandKathy]

http://joelandkathy.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/5118-the-dont-be-like-dale-competitioncontest/page__pid__128244__st__0entry128244

 

Hey FreeDog -

 

Join the contest! Have fun! Sweep her off her feet!

[Dashiki Ed 310]

Hey Free Dog

 

This is Ed. It was good to talk to you on the phone on Wednesday night. I am hoping that you are doing the homework we suggested to you and you are blessing Crystal and staying constantly and consistently focused on her. Don't forget that this is date night.

 

I do not post much on the forum but yesterday (19th) my morning Bible reading brought you to mind and I decided to get on here and read some of your story. It was a God thing as many of the words from my reading were used by you in your postings.

 

Wow. You have all the knowledge and resources that you need to be the Man of Crystal's Dreams and you do it for a few days here and a few days (more or less) there.

This is not going to come as anything new because I have seen it mentioned many times from others posting on your thread, you lack consistency. As we said on the call, you need to be focused on Crystal every second of every minute of every hour of every day of every week of every month of every year for the rest of your life. From the quote I read on the call this is "a long obedience in the same direction" and "every resolution to begin to obey must be followed by many decisions to continue".

You need to JUST DO IT!

 

This is a link to my reading from yesterday that brought you to mind, http://odb.org/2012/07/19/dorian-gray.

 

You can do this evidenced by your success for days at a time we need for those days to become weeks then months etc.

Commit yourself to this. Get both feet in the river. Be ALL IN.

If I can do this you can do this.

 

Ed of Ed and Tammy

[FreeDog]

Thanks Ed, appreciate you being on the call and yes I am doing the home work and plan on getting on the call tomorrow night.

[Dashiki Ed 310]

Sounds great! Will be listening in for a while on the call as I am on the morning side of my 12 hr shifts through Sunday which means I have to get up around 3:30 a.m.

 

Just keep Crystal at the forefront of your mind 24/7/365, there are no days off. Die to self. I know that at times this seems to be excruciating but one thing I always think of is when Jesus was in the garden and He prayed that God would let this cup pass from Him but that He agreed that the Father's will be done. While there He sweat as it were great drops of blood, and as bad as this dying to self may "feel" to us in our minds (our battlefield in becoming more Christ-like), I have yet to sweat great drops of blood. I don't think it will ever get that bad and to think He did that for you, for me, for His bride.

 

You can do this!

 

Be blessed.

Ed of Ed and Tammy

[FreeDog]

Appreciate the encouragement Ed. that is definately selfish pride that thinks it deserves a day off or a parade. It is all worth it in the end, she is such a blessing.

[Dashiki Ed 310]

We have to stay plugged in (calls,forum,books and dvd's) and keep moving forward. Keep Crystal at the forefront of your mind. Do the things we talked about read and make time to sit together (foot massage) and talk with Crystal what you have read and initiate getting on the calls 2 or 3 times a week and date nights.

 

Take time to recharge like Steve mentioned but once you have then you come out and bless your wife. I was not able to listen to the whole call with you two since I had to work the next morning so keep working on these things and anything Steve suggested too.

 

You have to show Crystal that you are committed to changing and it will take time but you can do it as long as you become and remain consistent.

 

Again, you can do this.

[TimothyPaul]

How did your morning wake up exercise go?

 

What did you ask God for? - How did it affect your day?

[TimothyPaul]

FD -

 

You were just at an intensive. How come you have not been posting?

[FreeDog]

Well TP, I have no excuse, or at least no legitimate excuses.

 

The Intensive renewed a desire to drive Crystal closer instead of away. It has been a rough start on my part and that is frustrating and discouraging to Crystal. I know what to do, in "the moment", they arise so fast, my gut rises to the top. i think i will start shuting up and thinking before responding, it my make a huge difference. The only thing my gut says in relationship that is worth while is "I'm hungry, lets eat."

 

Yesterday Crystal was sharing some good stuff after church, my response of "Yeah, you deserve better." hit her hard, at that point I reacted in anger to her comment instead of shutting up, looking and then respond in the opposite by realizing I had hurt Crystal. like she said in her post it effectively shut her up which I see was my unconscience desire for some perverted reason, it would have bgeen interesting and fun to persue her line of thinking on the love of God.

 

There are issues in my heart that have been revealed that I need to deal with, but not in a way that harms Crystal. Last night after listening to the phone call Crystal was talking and I started rebelling, she sensed it and asked "What?" I did the opposite by sending the spirit away and drawing to her, but made the mistake of letting her know how much an issue it was instead of just gently saying I had a spirit of rebellion, that is just one of my ferral pets.

 

I know my fight and I know my allies. So, TP, this is my post-intensive post, a little late and Crystal had to set it all up, poor dear.

[FreeDog]

I t has been so long since I have posted here and now I really need some advice.

I argue and defend when my wife (Crystal) shares any kind of feeling/emotion. I find myself doing it daily like this morning, she pointed it out and I hadn't realized I was doing it, until she said so and then it was obvious.

 

I would appreciate any practical advice on how to overcome this "habit" for it is keeping us stuck on the ground floor of a happy marriage. Please don't say "Just don't do it." Even though that is true it means nothing to a formerly passive guy. I need help here, I hate killing her with this problem. there are other areas but this one is a real "sandburr in the shoe" problem, if you know what I mean.

[TimothyPaul]

Read chapter 13 of John Maxwell's "The 21 indispensable qualities of a Leader". Apply it to being the spiritual leader of your home.

[For Him For Her]

Free dog,

 

Simply ask your wife if she could help you. All she has to do is make a declarative statement with either " this is or you are making me feel or I am feeling". As soon as you hear any one of these statements, turn off the defense switch and turn on the listen switch followed by the resolve switch.

 

God Bless

David

[FreeDog]

I did order the John Maxwell book, it looks like a good read.

Crystal does declarative statements, when she is not pressured by her feelings. When she does it works well, but alot of times she just does not have the time, feelings happen.

i found this morning that when my attitude is "right" it is not hard to listen to her feelings and not react to them. Self-pity is something that creeps in unawares, that and ego, they are both very subtle but hugely destructive and I am not always aware of their presence. This is when i need to listen to and accept what Crystal says no matter how much it hurts my pride, fact is I want that pride hurt. Sometimes it seems like my pride is a mole in a mole hitting game.
I also learned again this morning that I am deceptive to a fault and will give two answers for a question requiring only one, then get angry because she chooses the wrong answer. I didn't get angry this morning when she pointed it out, I was glad she did, but I do do that. Difference today is I want to be with her and I know attitude is everything, it is a condition of the heart.

Edited January 10, 2013 by FreeDog

[For Him For Her]

Free dog,

 

If you are a part of the men's group, I am leading the call tonight and will address these issues. There seems to be a running theme with all the guys on the forums now.

 

God Bless

David

Edited January 11, 2013 by For Him For Her

[FreeDog]

Didn't have the opportunity to get on the men's call last night David, but it sounds interesting and I will look for it in the recording section and down load it when it becomes available.

 

It really isn't a mystery what the problem is, it is as Joel says; When she shares a concern my first reaction, (if I am self -absorbed/insecure), is to resist, defend, deny. If I am thinking outside my self it is easy to realize these are her feelings and they are a good thing.

 

Learning to realize that the only response in the moment is to listen and respond in love and compassion. One way that I respond is by becoming all about me, me, me...I, I, I... in my responses thus shutting up the very thing I need to hear. I also respond by becoming pathetic, Your right I am that bad, or yeah I'm no good... effectively shutting her down again. I know these things but the moments come so quick. Attitude is what I think counts the most as it comes from the heart. When my attitude is correct there is no thinking involved, the responses are instant and caring. looking back at a past response staying connected to the ministry, yeah how many times have I heard that and realize I back-slide when I don't stay connected.

 

How do you, David,handle the moments? They hit so quick how did you train yourself to realize the pride sweeling up to stop it? I don't usually notice it until after when Crystal is screaming that my pride is blocking my ears and heart.

 

One thing is for sure; I do not know how to be a good husband, but I thank God that Crystal is still here to tell/show me how.

Edited January 12, 2013 by FreeDog

[For Him For Her]

Freedog,

 

I realized, if someone was coming at me and giving me grief that there had to be some validity in what they were trying to express to me. I learned, if I stopped and listened, I couldn't be angry or upset for more than a minute. Most times when someone is sharing from this place with us, we did do something to hurt or upset them. If I didn't want this situation to happen again, I needed to figure out where the break down was and without fail I started inside myself.

 

It was a struggle at first and the internal battle was excrucaiting but I resolved in myself to make this problem go away. We defend because we think there must be a right and wrong in everything. Therefore, one of us has to be wrong here. The reality is most wives are expressing a feeling. Feelings are not right nor are they wrong. They just are. If we want to stop these crazy cycles, we have to learn to listen to the other person's feelings and learn to communicate ours without judging who is right or wrong.

 

Your wife may be feeling something that really bothers her. She may be seeing a situation from a different perspective which is making her feel this way. It is the perspective that is making here feel this way in this case not you. Even though it appears she is blaming you, she is only trying to make the feeling go away. She doesn't care whose fault it is or isn't. She just wants it gone. Your job is to help her make the feeling go away by listening. If you are in help mode instead of defense mode, she will be less tense and irriitated which will help her to communicate more clearly.

 

It boils down to when you feel it rising up inside you take it to the cross and lay it at His feet. Then you man-up. Choke the life out of it and listen. Over time, it becomes easier and easier. It will come to the point where it will be automatic for you to shut the defense button off anytime she is speaking with you. Not only does this make her relax and feel more comfortable, it does the same thing for you.

 

Initiate/respond. You intiate understanding to her. She responds in understanding to you. It may take awhile but it really is this simple.

 

God Bless

David

[FreeDog]

Thanks for the advice. My current mindset says i don't want to put in the hard work; it also says it is not possible. It is hugely important to change that mindset to a "can-do" mindset. Actually that isn't that hard to do for it is actually becoming easier to listen and validate, it is getting easier to quit defending, and our relationship is better than it was.

 

Your thoughts that she is not blaming only trying to make the feeling go away is something to come to grips with and take home. I do see it as an attack on me, not a painful situation for Crystal that she is trying to make go away, the only way she can. How embarrassing that i continue to offer her so much immaturity.

 

Positive, positive how important is the mindset. It is getting easier to think of others, but I do bungle it up at times, like last night. i was watching the Bulls and she had asked for some attention; being in neverland I didn't hear her the first two times and when I did I pinched her thigh without thinking then got angry at her for getting angry at me for the hurtful attention I gave her. one big reactive scene. We did resolve it, fairly quickly this time, it does illustrate the importance of focusing out and listening to the marriage manual and not my un-marriage manual in my gut. It was bizzare because we were having a great afternoon and then out of the blue this reactive child comes out. Too often it happens, I want to kill it!

 

I am open to any and all advice, yes we have been in the ministry a while, but head knowledge only goes so far, we do want a happy marriage.

[FreeDog]

Had a wonderful time last evening as we were sitting waiting to watch Wisconsin basketball, the discussion was about feelings. Normally this is a subject I find very tedious and end up absorbing her feelings and spitting them back as anger in order to quiet them. Crystal is a very sensative person and feelings are her; if I claim to love her yet try to deny her feelings then I am a hypocrite and only despise her for having feelings. So after precieving what her feelings are my job is to love her and embrace her, not grab at her or try to minimize and take on the feeling. This my be elmentry stuff but has been a huge struggle for me.

 

A lot of times I hear her feelings and then the

hug I attempt to give her she rejects because the hug is for me and my "hurt" feelings used to manipulate her into shutting her up and not for understanding. Two summers ago we were visiting a couple involved in the ministry looking for help and the husband gave his wife a kiss and complimented her. Crystal said "That was real", meaning the affection was about the wife not the husband. Last night as I stamped a letter this scene came to my mind and i attempted to duplicate it. Crystal refused the attention saying something to the affect that it was not for her but me. I right away realized she was right and explained the story to her, alot of times I just agree with her not really realizing what I am agreeing to because she does "feel" things long before I ever do. This time it was really fresh, was amazing though how fast she picks these things up, almost kinda creepy.

 

Creating a mindset of loving Crystal and keeping her foremost is to think of her feelings first. How is she feelinf? Is she mad at her boss, did her son do something stupid, is she upset at some bone head thing I did (again)? These are the questions to ask, not oh no she is mad at me again. My feelings don't count as they are just steeped in anger really, her's are actual and they are how she percieves and responds to her environment, she made an interesting comment that her memories were attached to feelings. What she expresses she needs most is just a sounding board for them.

 

Interesting thing about the sounding board I realized is that it is not just a blank board or a stuffed animal that just sits there. She expresses a feeling and waits for the sounding or echo; if I hear her correctly I will repeat what she said void of commentary and then wait and see if a fuller response is required. It dawned on me that this is conversation, duh.

 

I am aware of the "pressure" that rises up, great Freedog very good, now I need to aquire the ability to give it to Christ when it rises. I suppose that requires thinking, lol.

 

Last night feelings made sense and didn't seem scary but kinda "fun" really. We'll see what prevails this evening. Crystal is a wonderful blessing and I thank God for his longsuffering.

[MaryJane]

she made an interesting comment that her memories were attached to feelings.

 

I like this. Your wife has a very good grasp of the English language. I admire her for how well she is able to express herself.

[FreeDog]

Yes MJ, Crystal does express herself very well and creatively. Her mother and father were both very creative people and Crystal embodies that creatvity and takes it to the next level. She loves words and her word studies are a real treat. I look forward to them and if I am out-focused she will share them, it really is an incentive.

 

Last evening as we were sitting together in the evening I read the chapter from John Maxwell's book that TP had suggested. Once finished Crystal started sharing her feelings about it; that it sounded like something I would twist into abusing her with. Then she shared it felt like I was reacting to her. First, she does have reason for her feelings of twisting the book around, like four years of not "loving it and living it". Then her feeling of reacting was verified with me reacting looking for the right thing to say. When she says that I am reacting I end up going down the drain trying to not react feeling helpless and that is the abuse makes her feel guilty. Last night I did feel the "pressure", failed to stop reacting and ended up taking my glass into the kitchen to regroup.

 

Reacting in our household is me taking on the feeling and having my own anger feelings about it becoming a "stupid-head".

 

I was able to figure out that my trying was looking inside myself for the answer, and I know there ain't anything there that is positive, so to stop the reacting is to focus out again and break down the wall and come out towards her. Reacting time was shortened and a lousey arrested developement night was avoided. She has never wanted perfection only to realize that the answers are listening to her and hearing her feelings.

 

About the chapter in the book. I can see that my tendency is to say what I will do and then not put it into practice and expect kudos for the great thing I have done. Instead of the other way around of doing then talking. it also showed me that I wait for "tasks" from Crystal instead of taking the initiative myself to seek help for change.

 

Crystal is a good friend, the very best. I have not been a good friend towards her. I want to become her best friend, and as she said last night, the competion is going to be tuff!

[FreeDog]

^{Help, I am stuck in self-centered mode and can't get out!}

^{How do you love someone for themselves without self getting in the way? Stupid question I know but I am serious. I am such a prideful, arrogant, sel-fish, decietful, resentful, manipulative person that loving someone for themselves seems impossible. I focus on Crystal for a time, but it always goes back to self. I can't seem to die to it without its ugly head coming back and it is killing Crystal.}

 

^{I know..."Focus out." "Listen to her." "Die to self." Ok, I get it, although if I "get it" or not is not the issuse, but rather how what I do affects Crystal, focusing on how she feels...}